Safety First?

[Sukhdev Singh]

don't forget we lost someone a couple of years ago in a bad collision. from personal experience if a collision is inevitable do a self wipeout and pull the rig down on top of you.

classic remark i once came across:
q: "why do you wear a helmet when you windsurf?"
a: "because of the way you gybe"

[sarfing]

Yesterday I was in starboard sailing, wind was strong, this guy coming close towards me with no sign of giving way, I had to drop my sail last minute, just managed to avoid a collision.  I will avoid this red & white sail angmo far far away next time

[blackhawk81]

Yesterday I was in starboard sailing, wind was strong, this guy coming close towards me with no sign of giving way, I had to drop my sail last minute, just managed to avoid a collision.  I will avoid this red & white sail angmo far far away next time

Yah.. A lot of sailors don't observe the right of way sailing, i had similar encounter before (check my previous post : right of way). Perhaps a prominent notice of sailing rules could be put up in the club to remind people on this again.  Sail safe.

[PlaneSailin]

Yesterday I was in starboard sailing, wind was strong, this guy coming close towards me with no sign of giving way, I had to drop my sail last minute, just managed to avoid a collision.  I will avoid this red & white sail angmo far far away next time

Wha--?  Yesterday?  Red & white sail ang moh?  That wasn't me, was it?  Are you making this up?    I don't remember being anywhere near anybody else yesterday; I went out, got 2 runs and crawled back underpowered.  

Oh, wait, there are 2 other red & white sail ang mohs on weekday sailing duty...must've been one of them.  Haha!  

Anyhow, I'm not going to change course if giving way involves creating a near-miss situation, going directly across the other guy's bows in powered-up conditions.   Depending on our positions, it's often actually easier and safer for both to just keep clear.  

Don't forget, the sailor heading back in can claim some priority over the one heading out, which may not exactly cancel the Starboard rule, but if you add it to the avoid-collision-at-all-costs rule, I think you will it find that it's too close to call.  So better just assume nobody knows anything about the rules, and stay away!

[sarfing]

Don't forget, the sailor heading back in can claim some priority over the one heading out, which may not exactly cancel the Starboard rule,

I was heading back in and on starboard, anyway. That would have been better  if that guy just say sorry. We were that close, not even have to shout to hear it.

[PlaneSailin]

One day there may be another bad accident, and we will all be a very sorry bunch indeed 

[38 mph]

And in Kuantan this week, 2 truckers were killed whilst repairing their truck on the hard shoulder. Another truck drove into them.
Then a similar thing with a family in a broken down car.
Why does that happen ?
I dont want to sail near anybody unless I'm racing.
Even then, I manged to run over poor old Manny Cabillis head in Boracay.
Well, he'd had one of those shaved head hair dos and looked like a buoy.
Luckily, a few stitches and 20 bottles of San Miguel put him right.
Sail safe.
Wear rubber.
 

[jacktan]

Can PlaneSailin or anyone enlighten me as to why someone heading back has some form of priority over someone heading out?
Also, if changing course causes a near miss, it makes sense not to change course. If Port needs to bear down drastically, then chances are Port would cross ahead of Starboard safely without changing course. If that's not the case, then it's probably because Port and Starboard are already too close and there is a real risk of collision. In this case, Port can also ease out, stall and enjoy the scenery for a while before continuing. And Starboard should not change course, not even out of courtesy as it may lead to confusion.

Perhaps trainees doing the proficiency course should be required to take a simple test that contains safety questions based on common sailing situations.

[Pauly75ts]

"enlighten me as to why someone heading back has some form of priority over someone heading out?"

Hi! there, JackTan,

Windsurfers heading in has no right of way.

Appendix B of the ISAF Racing Rules of Sailing 2009-2012
http://www.sailing.org/tools/documents/RRS20092012with2010changes-%5B8222%5D.pdf

B4.1 Right-of-Way Rules
These rules replace all rules of Part 2.

(a) COMING IN AND GOING OUT
A board coming in shall keep clear of a board going out. When
two boards are going out or coming in while on the same wave,
or when neither is going out or coming in, a board on port tack
shall keep clear of one on starboard tack.

(b) BOARDS ON THE SAME WAVE, COMING IN
When two or more boards are on a wave coming in, a board
that does not have possession shall keep clear.

Everyone out on the water has a responsibility to ensure the safety of everyone out at sea. Even you have the right of way, it is stated in the following regulations that if a collision happens, you are also responsible.

International Regulations For Preventing Collisions At Sea
http://inoa.net/zeilen/colreg.html

RULE 2 - Responsibility
   1. Nothing in these Rules shall exonerate any vessel, or the owner, master or crew thereof, from the consequences of any neglect to comply with these Rules or of the neglect of any precaution which may be required by the ordinary practice of seamen, or by the special circumstances of the case.
   2. In consenting and complying with these Rules due regard shall be had to all dangers of navigation and collision and to any special circumstances, including the limitations of the vessels involved, which may make a departure from these Rules necessary to avoid immediate danger.

If a person has undergo training in watersports, and is not aware of the safety requirements to do it safely, it's because their coach/instructor did not teach them.  More often than not, the coach/instructor do not know the safety requirement themselves.  I've witness for myself when it happens. I'm sure you've read about some of the incidents through the years too.

Regards

Paul Yong

[Ian]

For Jack

There was a right of way rule, where the outgoing had right of way over the incoming, which came into force when sailing in waves.

I am not sure if it was an official rule in the beginning, or came about to address the need when sailing in big wave breaks.

Seems that the rule is now cast in stone.

[PlaneSailin]

looks like I got that one backwards.
I read it in a forum somewhere, when people were debating the same issue. It just seemed to make sense, as a matter of courtesy, as the guy coming in is often aiming for a specific point...no prob

[Chubby]

If a person has undergo training in watersports, and is not aware of the safety requirements to do it safely, it's because their coach/instructor did not teach them.  More often than not, the coach/instructor do not know the safety requirement themselves.  I've witness for myself when it happens. I'm sure you've read about some of the incidents through the years too.

Regards

Paul Yong

All who goes thru e courses has been thought 3 basic rules, whether e students remembers n practices is totally different altogether.

[NT]

Appendix B of the ISAF Racing Rules of Sailing 2009-2012
http://www.sailing.org/tools/documents/RRS20092012with2010changes-%5B8222%5D.pdf

B4.1 Right-of-Way Rules
These rules replace all rules of Part 2.

(a) COMING IN AND GOING OUT
A board coming in shall keep clear of a board going out. When
two boards are going out or coming in while on the same wave,
or when neither is going out or coming in, a board on port tack
shall keep clear of one on starboard tack.

(b) BOARDS ON THE SAME WAVE, COMING IN
When two or more boards are on a wave coming in, a board
that does not have possession shall keep clear.

Everyone out on the water has a responsibility to ensure the safety of everyone out at sea. Even you have the right of way, it is stated in the following regulations that if a collision happens, you are also responsible.

International Regulations For Preventing Collisions At Sea
http://inoa.net/zeilen/colreg.html

RULE 2 - Responsibility
   1. Nothing in these Rules shall exonerate any vessel, or the owner, master or crew thereof, from the consequences of any neglect to comply with these Rules or of the neglect of any precaution which may be required by the ordinary practice of seamen, or by the special circumstances of the case.
   2. In consenting and complying with these Rules due regard shall be had to all dangers of navigation and collision and to any special circumstances, including the limitations of the vessels involved, which may make a departure from these Rules necessary to avoid immediate danger.

If a person has undergo training in watersports, and is not aware of the safety requirements to do it safely, it's because their coach/instructor did not teach them.  More often than not, the coach/instructor do not know the safety requirement themselves.  I've witness for myself when it happens. I'm sure you've read about some of the incidents through the years too.

Regards

Paul Yong

Hi Paul,

I think you may have interpreted and applied the rules wrongly. These rules you quoted are under the heading B4 RULES FOR EXPRESSION COMPETITION.

Sometimes, wrong application of rules can be more dangerous that not knowing the rules. For example if you were going out on port tack and another sailor was coming in on starboard tack and both of you were in collision course, and both of you held your course because both of you think that you have right of way.......what would had happened?

As far as I know, nobody is doing waves sailing in Singapore, so this coming in and going out rules don't apply.

And Chubby is correct to say that students do not necessary practise what is taught by their instructors during the basic course. (This is from my experience as an instructor at PA in the 90s).

Nick

[PlaneSailin]

Rule 1: Avoid collisions

Rule 2: If in doubt, refer to Rule 1

Right of way be damned!

(I think we have a winner!)

[Pauly75ts]

"whether e students remembers n practices is totally different altogether."

Hi! there, Chubby,

I'm sure everyone knows that it's happening all the time.

I hope if there's any doubt on the part of safety, questions should be answered whenever someone ask.

I've only 1 rule to follow, Safety is paramount and it's better to be safe than sorry.

Regards

Paul Yong